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Hyper .21 8P modify QUEST
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 1:26 pm    Post subject: Hyper .21 8P modify QUEST Reply with quote

I have a .21 8P that I modify and I just wonder who else have this engine modify. Why? I was tuning the carb with the original setting like we have posted here, well I end up closin the high needle also the idler neddle the engine get to 193 degrees I try to get it higher driving it hard for almost 2 tanks but didnt do the trick to do a better tunning but the nigh came fast and I stop, cus dont make sence tuning in a 68 degree weather. One thing I notice was that a full tank of gas last between 7.30minutes to 8.0minuts and the engine off the hole was bugging but that was when I stop tuning, I know I can get better time per tank. Once clearout, in WOT is like a roket to the point that you can see the dirt flying. An other note, the exhaust when I was tuning feels very strong if you hold your hand in front of the pipe. One thing that I notice was with the igniter on the plug I get better idle that without it. My gess is change the plug to a hotter one. The fuel was 20%. Now The real question is, A modify engine need a hotter plug or high % of nitrus or both? I was looking in you tube a guy with a modify Novarossy and he state that He was getting 10.30minuts per tank and he is tuning to get 11minuts per tank. Looks like when you modify an engine you get better performance,less high temp and fuel. Well, any feed back, coments about this matter will be welcome. thanks

Last edited by VWVR6_T on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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thunderbolt427



Joined: 15 Aug 2009
Posts: 119
Location: Alabama

PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What modifications have you done or had done done to it? Depending on modifications your motor will need a much different tune compared to a stock motor. You say you can only get the motor to 193 degrees in 68 degree weather. In general the colder it is outside the richer you will want to set your fuel settings and, use a hotter plug. When its cold outside the air has a higher oxygen content so, you need more fuel . The plug also needs to be hotter in the cold to burn the fuel efficiently. You said you closed the high speed needle(if you did that it wouldn't run at all). If you turn the needle clock wise you lean the motor out. counter clock wise will richen the motor more. If you can only get 193 degrees from your motor running it hard its probably set a little rich or ,possibly the plug is to cold causing the motor to run rich(not burning the fuel your putting into the motor). I would get based on what you've said a hotter plug and, watch the temperature. if it goes up a lot on you you would need to richen(move the high speed needle counter clock wise) the fuel mixture to cool the motor back down. No reason you cant run in the 220 -230 range. Youll see more power and better run times as well. Im not saying youll get 10 minutes from a tank of gas but ,it should improve.
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well the sleeve is polish to mirror finish and ported, I did it in the same directions as it was in the sleeve, the crank shaft was polish in the inside and fix the opening where he suck the air, I get a new connecting rod cus the one in the engine was too loose. I remove the coper shim in the head and used a long medium temp. plug(cant remember the number) Car rans very good in WOT, tomorrow Im going to the track with a new plug (hot) and the same 20% nitro , to see how perform. When I refer to the needle that I close them, I didnt mean that, I adjust the needle leaner i comparasion to the Original specs. I would like to know how long can you go in 1 fuel tank, to compare with mine. Will post what I did, later. Thanks

Last edited by VWVR6_T on Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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hyper dragger



Joined: 27 Jun 2009
Posts: 18
Location: Tinley park, Il

PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope that I can help you out with this problem. I have had the very same issue that you have going on. The high speed needle doesn't react well to any changes and you have to turn it in all the way till it just about bottoms out. I ended up putting a card from another hyper on it and it was like new. So I think that you should get a gasket kit for it and make sure the whole thing is sealed up nice. I'm not 100% positive that the gasket will fix it because I replaced the whole carb but I am 90% sure this will fix you up. What are your other needles set at though. And with everything in the motor modified in some way I can get 6:30 to 7:00 on a 75cc tank and use byron gen 2 30% race
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hyper dragger wrote:
I hope that I can help you out with this problem. I have had the very same issue that you have going on. The high speed needle doesn't react well to any changes and you have to turn it in all the way till it just about bottoms out. I ended up putting a card from another hyper on it and it was like new. So I think that you should get a gasket kit for it and make sure the whole thing is sealed up nice. I'm not 100% positive that the gasket will fix it because I replaced the whole carb but I am 90% sure this will fix you up. What are your other needles set at though. And with everything in the motor modified in some way I can get 6:30 to 7:00 on a 75cc tank and use byron gen 2 30% race


Went today to finish tuning, I get a os plug A5 wich is hotter than the A3 and decide to keep playing with 20% but this time race blend. As soon I crank the engine start up and stay in idle with a little of difficult till i get it tunning OK, idle is done but still was bugging a little off the hole but clear out very quik, better than the first day. The engine,is seal everything but the O rings for the needles even that I fund a good tunning for it and ran for 3 tanks non stop. The temp when up to 240 and the engine feels very strong, I try with a picco Truggy .26 3P just for fun in straigt line, sorry but the picco was left behind. The only thing I got left is get the seal kit for the carb, switch to a 30% but I will try go back to a medium Glow plug to see how engine react and later switch to a hot glow plug to see what happen and and try againg. Let see if I can stop him to bugging on lower RPM's. But over all, I'm happy because he respond to the changes that I did today( hot plug) and I get the chance to really run it. Oh! I didn't check how open are the needles, will check later and let you know, I'll like to know how many turns do yo have in yours that way I can compare and see if this engines have a pattern on the tuning once they are modify, I know a lot of us said that every engine is different, just wonder.This may help an other fellows with this engine. I beleive is a very good engine for the price.
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Streaks



Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yo VWVR6 (great handle btw, I drive a TDi dummy :D ), would you be able to provide pics? I'd be interested in trying this on my hyper 8p as well.

Thanks man!
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Streaks wrote:
Yo VWVR6 (great handle btw, I drive a TDi dummy :D ), would you be able to provide pics? I'd be interested in trying this on my hyper 8p as well.

Thanks man!


Yeah dude, I can post some pics tomorrow, I mean later today. The TDi is stock? later
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a few pictures of the Sleeve, Dont have pictures of the crank. I never get to get it tune on bottom end. The buggy have an accident and filter came off and the rest is hystory. But I would said once I get the car running the Idle was a little high but I manage to keep the temp @ 230-240, once you get it to temp this guy just RIP. Also I get @9 1/2min a tank I know I can get a little over 10min. I have a few different pipes to test the engine, to se how react. Gears? a have to lower to 13TCB to get a little more punch on lower RPM, this seems to work fair well. There is a lot of questions in my head, I'm looking for an other one do all over again to see how perform. As right now the engine seems to be more for on road than for off road(I know some one is going to said simething different), But again I didn't get to test all the gears and pipes that I have for it. This was test in a Ofna Ultra old model that it is a TANK compare to the new buggys around, a lot lighter. We all know that the weight play a very important role when you looking for performance. As for now I'm looking for a new, lighter buggy and a other Hyper 8P race or if anybody have a used Sleeve and Piston in the corner of your tool box i can take it out of your hands, This engine can perform well against 400.00 engines thi is with good driving skills as we all know.. Here a few pics of the sleeve, there is a few thing that can be better but that is for the next victim.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3950432513/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3950428007/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3950421201/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3951209142/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3950432513/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3951217298/in/photostream/
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Streaks



Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL it says those pics are private man :)

And ya the TDi is stock for right now, plan on getting larger injectors and a chip for it later when I'm working a real job again.

I've done some machining work in my past, so if I just even have some pics of all the cuts to go by, I'm sure I can reproduct the results on my engine as well :)
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Streaks wrote:
LOL it says those pics are private man :)

And ya the TDi is stock for right now, plan on getting larger injectors and a chip for it later when I'm working a real job again.

I've done some machining work in my past, so if I just even have some pics of all the cuts to go by, I'm sure I can reproduct the results on my engine as well :)


My bad, Now u can see them.
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Streaks



Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL, yay TDi!!!




Good pics! Finally someone posting on a forum who has a good camera :) It's cool to see the sleeve comes with the ports tuned the way they are though, I haven't had mine out to look at it yet.

Have you thought about smoothing out your ports some to increase aerodynamics the way the stock ports are done?

What I really need to see though is the crank or any other bottom end mods. I have a tabletop mill and lathe and am a dremel expert too so I got it all covered :D Just need pics to go by. Hell I even have a prop balancer I can balance the crank with.


Thanks for the update man!!
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, What I did beside of the mods that you saw on the pics. The crank I reshape just a little the opening under the carb. Try to polish as mus as I can the the crank(the weight or balancer) and inside the tunel on it. The Block came with a very nice finish inside(by the rear cap goes on) just try to polish a little. But there is not much to do with the crank and the block. If the connecting rod is good no extra play in the crank you can shape the side like a knife(if you know what i mean) and polish it, make sure the lubrication hole in the rod are clean once you finish. If you have to order a new rod they came fix already with the mod (that's what I did, Nitro House @14.50) very cheap compared to the Italian mills. About the sleeve, modify the sleeve in the same direccion that they are, the 2 ports biside the exhaust port make the notch oposite the direction to the exhaust. I have my engine apart I will make other shots of the sleeve that I never took and the crank shaft so you can see what I mean. BTW The picture of the TDI was in Mid Ohio for Koni Challange last june.
Let me know if you have any questions.
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In this picture try to reshape in the same way that is in the sleeve and to to much like I did, reason why is because I didn't get to test the engine at 100% even that the Ultra wich is a tank kinda fly in WOT. http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3972163288/?eOrig=3950424277 you are goint to reshape from your Rt to the Lt, from small to larger are w/o touch the chamber net to it in the left.

In this photo just reshape the bottom for better flow. http://www.flickr.com/photos/42863383@N04/3971361525/in/photostream/

The Crank like I said befor just try to polish don't spect to get it to mirror polish just with a dremell but will be smoother than before.

Try to get a pipe that can give you bottom and mid, this engine have a lot in WOT.

Fuel 30%. When I start tast this eng. I used 20% race with a med Glow plug it wasn't that good in idle, switch to hot plug then I get better iddle. I'm sure with 30% and start test with a med. plug.

Carb, make sure is seal as the rest of the engine. I start with this needle adjustments http://www.ofna.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4339 from RobB, then start adjustment as needed, the needle will be closer or leaner that original. I get almost 9.30min a tank and I didn't finish set the low needles correctly. This engine with a good tune you may get 10min a tank. The idle may be a little high than a regular engine.

For those witha regular pullstart hyper 8P not race the difference is the crack, the race used a larger crank( dont try to fit a Race crank on a reguler 8P case won't fit because the bearing, need to change the bearing). You still gat get a very good power out of it.

ps: I just buy a new hyper 8P not race (very good deal can't pass) may finish what I start with the the 8P race. Any input on this will be welcome.
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Streaks



Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm tempted to try your mods man. I have a regular 8P with the pullstart. Mine has the little fuel slinger in the case if I understand it correctly.

Seeing as my crank is the smaller one, any suggestions there of what NOT to do? :)


Thanks man, I appreciate your posting all this!
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VWVR6_T



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 383
Location: Western, PA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't get my wrong, the difference between the 8P race and the 8P is the crank and the inner bearing, but that does't mean that you can't get any performance out of it. You still can get a kick a** engine. The difference in performance both stock is .2HP according to OFNA and the reace rev higher. A few mods that you can do are 1. Polish the outer side of the sleeve. 2. Try to polish the crank shaft(weight and tunnel) 3. In the bottom of the sleeve have like a line from the mold, you can eliminate that and make it smooth (this should be the first thing to do before polish the sleeve) 4. knife edge the rod may came with the rod already like that) 5. Replace the inner bearing for a ceramic bearing(this can be done after you done everything else and get it tune). 6. You can eliminate the pull start(this can be left for the end also). Also a good steady hand, a mech. glove(sleeve get really hot when polishing). Any brass polisher will do the job.
I just order this engine, if you want to wait for me to do the mods. I can post the pictures before and after with an explanation so you can see them.
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